What’s going on at NCA!
NCA Protest - Photo Courtesy Jaago NCA
UPDATE: make sure to read the comments from students and teachers presenting various aspects of the story below. Seems like many political forces are in action now and the situation is getting very messy indeed.
So there seems to much furor going on at the National College of Arts, NCA.
I have mentioned before in my posts about the confusion regarding the NCA Principal appointment controversy. After Principal Naazish Ataullah retired, Fauzia Qureshi (Head of Department Architecture) was posted as the Acting Principal. She retired from that position early this year. The year 2011 itself has been riddled with issues regarding federal or provincial ‘ownership’ of NCA and the fluctuating methods of assigning the new Principal – and I discussed them here in this post: Effing NCA Hullabaloo in February.
Now it seems that the situation has spiralled out of control. Over the summer vacations, Bashir Ahmed (Miniature ustaad extraordinaire/Department Head and also the last posted Head of Department Fine Arts) was assigned the position of Acting Principal. This has not been taken well by many of the students and the faculty due to various reasons, both personal and general. Some argue that he has superseded many other candidates that were senior and more suited to the position. Mostly people see this as a magnification of the problems the Fine Arts Department faced while he was the Head. That time period resulted in a complete breakdown of relationships and trust. Unfortunately, this was also used by the opportune to further their own interests in less than scrupulous ways.
I have acknowledged Bashir Sahab’s immense talent and also his immense amount of eccentricity, however I do also know that these qualities DO NOT automatically pave way for good administrative ones. Over the past few years, power politics within the senior teachers in the Fine Arts department have effectively translated into lobbying and partying of various groups. Many students in the Miniature department have been victim to the politics that have waged on between him and the progressive new, and also extremely talented, teachers.
But what has happened now?
There were all kinds of rumors flying around in the ‘Dengue-vacations‘, one that were as varying as they were stupendous! It was finally confirmed that the contracts of four teachers, in some cases very senior, have ‘not been renewed’. A polite way of saying: You’re Fired.
The teachers in question are Laila Rahman and Maryam Hussain from the Fine Arts Department and Irfan Ghani and Syed Aqeel Kazmi from the Architecture Department. Several news items and students also cite the names of Shireen Pasha (Head of Department Film & TV) and Sarwat Ali (Head of Department Musicology), but I cannot confirm that as yet. The four confirmed teachers hold important positions and have been instrumental in shaping student’s work and designing modern and more effective study modules and coursework. They also seem to have an ardent student following.
According to the Express Tribune, “The teachers said their contracts had been ‘terminated’ by the principal for personal reasons. The principal said the college Board of Governors (BoG) had decided not to extend their contracts and he had nothing to do with the decision.”
What a bloody mess! And for all of this to happen just months before the THESIS time is unbelievable and most of all UNFAIR to the students, who at this moment are already going through crunch time.
A large protest was organized at the NCA gates yesterday, Monday, September 27, 2011. Many members of the present faculty joined their protest and boycotted classes.
Photo courtesy Jaago NCA
JAAGO NCA is a student-run facebook group that is very active in reporting details and student feedback. It is also highlighting misreporting on the part of several journalists who say that the students were ‘forced’ to protest. Check it for updates and photographs.
The thing that I will ALWAYS love about NCA is the voicing of opinions through Non-Violent means. As students, we protested the attacks on Iraq and Afghanistan by the US Military by our silent protests and thought-provoking artworks on the Mall Road. The students today also chose to highlight a peaceful method of protest with messages of endearment towards the teachers that have been fired.
Many institutions in Pakistan have to take a page from NCA’s notebook when it comes to peaceful protests.
I don’t know what’s going to happen or if any corrective measures will be taken to address the student’s and teacher’s concerns. I don’t encourage maligning or blaming as good tactics either. But whatever happens, I do wish that the student’s get a satisfactory response and are able to continue their studies without these ridiculous and uncalled for hurdles. After all, it’s the students that make NCA.
I WISH THE STUDENTS THE BEST OF LUCK!
Always with a pinch of humor, always with a love for humanity. This photograph and the humorous twist on the famous slogan really had me smiling!
NCA Protest - Photo Courtesy Jaago NCA
NEWS REPORTS:
Here are a number of major news agencies covering the story in the past 2 days.
- NCA contracts: Students, faculty protest ‘termination’ of teachers – The Express Tribune
- NCA students stage protest against 4 teachers’ termination in Lahore – SAMAA Tv (make sure to click on the video link to hear the students talk.
- NCA students, faculty protest against teachers’ dismissal – Daily Times
- Students protest teacher’s sacking – The Nation
- NCA students Boycott Classes – Pakistan Today
The s.a. Project 
Waisay Saira, I have witnessed it all and the first year and second year students were really stopped from entering the premises by Seniors and mostly from Architecture department. And I have also seen students who wanted Maryam Hussain to be back from fine arts dep. who was their teacher. Some geniuen and mostly not so because i know our students are not that politically aware of the times they are living. I myself told students at the gate to do protests but when they really need that and they have something to get out of it for themselves.
But this is all orchestrated by the faculty who is being affected by this decision! And i am sorry to say that i didn’t like it.
Its good to mobilize students for reasonable stuff but i don’t buy this protest.
A contract is a contract and its not supposed to be getting renewed on your wishes all the times.
Maryam Hussain( i respect her and i would vote for her to be back), Leila Rehman and Hareem Tanveer were brought in by Naazish Atta Ullah and there were people kicked out in her term too. Nobody protested for those people who were kicked out in her term. One of your friends was i suppose more deserving at that point for the post Hareen Tanvir was appointed!
Any person from Architecture is Amzing if he/she becomes acting principal for years but anybody from fine arts is an A** H i suppose.
What have these architecture people have done so far by the way. Fouzia Qureshi didn’t want to listen to the students protests when they wanted to have their issues solved in the college and in the hostel. And look at the amazing structures at nca which have been built under Archi. amazing people. First year’s drawing studio has fallen off almost twice. And it still is in a dilapidated condition.
So what is it that makes them amazing. Just being friends with students and not really worrying about the real issues. Being quite progressive looking these people have their own agendas always. and i hate all that.
I think its time that students of NCA r e a l l y wake up and see all by themselves period!
Thank you so much for voicing your opinion Hasnat. It is imperative to know ALL sides of the story and I’m glad you shared yours. In detail and very politely. I have been in discussion with several students (3rd yr) who are saying that their demands are being maligned.And that several people are using this spread wrong stories. I do know that many students were genuinely there, but can’t say that for all of them.
I also feel that situation is very tense and many people will abuse this situation. The truth is, the last few years have been the same for the entire college. Politics seem to have taken over everything NCA and they seem to be destroying the core of this institution.
While I think that Bashir Sahab might not be the best choice for principal-ship I do NOT like how many media stories are projecting him.
I hope this can be resolved peacefully and properly.
But baat yeh hai key…yeh khap kabhie tau honi hi thi with all the inter-department tensions.
in reference to hasnaat’s comments about the protest being fueled by the teachers, i beg to differ. madam mariam hussain has never even once contacted any of her old students and asked us to protest for her. upon hearing of her dismissal, a couple of us third year and fourth year students were too shocked to even believe that a teacher of her calibre could be so unceremoniously fired. madam mariam hussain and madam laila rehman are responsible for most of the current fourth year F.A students’ skill and conceptual developement.. more than 3/4th of the FA student body chose maam mariam as their thesis tutor, which should bring to light as to how talented and dedicated a teacher she really is. never has madam mariam even once ignited any sort of political fire within us. these accusations are completely and utterly devoid of any concrete proof. if you are talking about a principal who is beneficial for the FA dept, then that is certainly, under no circumstances going to be Sir Bashir. if he knows whats good for the students, he will bring both these teachers back in a heartbeat.
and in all these pictures if you notice, are mostly first year students who actually don’t know who these teachers were!!!!
i Know As i am their teacher 🙂
Inqilaab zinda bad
i m sorry i sir, don’t mean any offense or disrespect of any kind but what teachers have going on is their own agenda we as student body want the teachers with whom we’ve already covered a large ground ;back ,as you said thesis students are in dilemma, because these teachers were their tutors how do you expect them to start over ,and im sorry to say but nca fine arts does NOT have competent teacher talent wise yes, as teachers most of them are a fail, so for us loosing marium hussain and laila rehman is a major set back also ,there aren’t any good teachers to be used as replacements other then a few! as for 1st yr. students being there they are there on their own will, nobody is forced all we as students are asking for is a little consideration which sadly is lacking. again no disrespect intended !
“A contract is a contract and its not supposed to be getting renewed on your wishes all the times.”
true ! just a thought though why now why in the middle of an academic yr. why the authorities are so reluctant to renew it when the thesis is four months away !
I agree that such terminations right before the Thesis can be very damaging. Even if the teachers are willing to offer time outside of college, it is hard for every student to avail it.
The fine arts department is the one the college is known for around the world. Not for the architects mostly:) I don’t underestimate the students by the way. They have gone far and must have done better on their own.
I suppose i have not made my point clear and i should say it again that this is the politics of the elders and students should not get involved or being thrown into it for their agendas! You don’t have any idea about that i could bet.
And i respect the teachers whose contracts are being nulled by the authorities. But this is not the way to deal with the things. They could have done it the right way i would say.
And if you guys are worried about your thesis and they are so concerned then they should have done that without being part of the college and should have given you time in the canteen as usual. Nobody would have objected:) But doing ll this right after the college was opened after so called hoax of dengue when already you guys had missed a lot. Not mentioning the extra vacation time due to Eid. Nobody wanted to come to college for those ten days but now thesis and the internals are so important. !!!
I still am not advocating your opposition by the way.
Just a minor correction for the record, both fine arts and architecture department have produced great names. NCA architects have won multiple UNESCO and other awards for their projects, have taught in Harvards and MITs etc.
It is my department, the design department, lagging behind in such excellence 🙂
i was part of this protest till yesterday! today what happened at the college was very disturbing. Arfan Ghani misbehaving with the the students and with the co-ordinator of M.A. programme (for not protesting) its impossible to enter the college and work! i am very very disturbed! i dont want to be part of anything thats political. i want to come and WORK! thats ALL I KNOW AND THATS ALL I CARE ABOUT. i dont care who gets kicked out!!!!! i honestly dont! i am very very angry!!
i have nothing against the protests. its just that… those who are not willing to be part of this “PROTEST/POLITICS” dont insist them. and let them leave. what students dont realize is… they’re the ones who ll suffer THE MOST…
trust me… 90% of students protesting.. dont even know why they’re protesting!! u go and ask them WHAT R U GUYS DOING HERE.. they’re like.. Uumm… ahh! the seniors are not letting us in. therefore we’re standing outside. DHU!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ugh* YAHAN INQELAAB NEHI AANE VALA!! :-@
are you serious =O! sadly that was the exact thing we were trying to avoid ,hot mess ! this be
Thank you Maria for giving us some insight of todays happening as i did not go to college today.
arfan ghani is MISBEHAVING! the students at the gate are MISBEHAVING! i mean, continue with your protest. we’re fine! but dont insult others. sad 😦 this is… NOT RITE!
That is just sad that things have come to this.
Save NCA from becoming like the other colleges where freedom of opinions, thought and speech are monitored.
Regardless of the matter, you guys should NOT have been stopped from working at any point. That is JUST as detrimental to the Thesis crunch.
i hope things get back to normal. we’re not going to college for another week. because of all these phaddas :-(( its almost october! we’re doomed*
And i know through this they will get their agendas and thier jobs back soon. Wake up students..
Saira, I completely agree with Sir Hasnat.
The criteria for a good teacher seems to be how well versed that person is at the English language. I really respect Maryam Hussain and Laila Rahman as people, but unfortunately, I don’t think they make the best teachers. What they seem to like in work has over the years become very predictable. Their critique is mostly about the “idea” or the “concept” behind the work that students produce, rather than the quality of work. I personally believe that it’s not what you do, it’s how you do it. They do forget that people this young (and twenty somethings are young) need to have more experience before they can claim to have such profound explanations for what they have produced. This also gives rise to a growing number of students who think art is about bullshitting your way out of a jury. Words like “disturbing” and “psychologically dark” have become almost fashionable. The word “spirituality” has been over used and almost stripped of all meaning. I mean I cannot see someone’s spirituality in badly painted concentric circles. I can only see badly painted concentric circles. They seem to be dwelling in cliches and then trying to inflict those cliches on to other peoples’ work. This is unfair. There is an ancient saying that “what harms is also what cures”, I hope to God that Bashir Sahab proves to be something like that. And I also believe that he is being unfairly treated. There seems to be a trend in our generation to pass controversial comments without knowing any factual details, People do seem to have utter disregard for regulations, I mean how hard is it to understand that if your contract has expired, then your contract has expired. Let go with grace. This is a highly colonial attitude, makes getting independence meaningless.
Bashir Sahab is one of the last remaining Titans of Art that are left in our country. Not to mention he has a great sense of humor! I don’t really know about Arfan Ghani or Aqeel Kazmi, But I’m sure their time was actually up too.
This is my opinion, I hope I haven’t offended anyone because that was not my intention.
these comments should really have a ‘like’ button
Thank you for voicing your concerns. And don’t worry you have not offended anyone by saying what you feel. While you may be entitled to your opinion and the others to theirs, we must all rise above them to see what is for the betterment of the efficient running of the system.
We must not fall into the much-too-familiar trap of taking sides and hating the opposition. There is a middle ground. What’s going on is harmful. I like Bashir shb as a person too, but I don’t agree with mid-break contract endings that effect the running of a school system. Secondly, I don’t think it should be simple enough to say ‘someones time is up’ when they have put a lifetime of work into something.
On the other hand, I also don’t think Bashir Shb should be maligned like what’s happening right now. The Board of Governors needs to step in salvage the situation.
NCA is for everyone. The traditionalists and the contemporaries. Those that love Bashir Shb and those that love Maryam Hussain. NCA shouldn’t have to be a place where people have to decide what side to choose.
You are right, this thing needs to be resolved. I do not label myself as a tradtionalist or a contemporary. But I can see the difference between what is genuine and what is pseudo and kitsch. There is also a difference between good art and bad art. I am not taking sides either. Maryam Hussain and Laila Rahman can be quite informative at times. But Artists, as Artists should not be so dependent on guidance, they should rely on their own judgement and their own good sense.
When I graduated, no sculpture student graduated that year. This can be seen as the beginning of the extinction of sculpture. The sculpture classes went through a huge change, first years weren’t even taught clay modelling, as we were in our first year. This change in curriculum did not happen in Bashir Sahab’s tenure, but nobody protested against it. All I am trying to say is that if this happened to someone like Jamil Baloch or R.M.Naeem, they would have encouraged the students to give their thesis rather than get mixed up with politics. And frankly that’s also because both are artists who exhibit their work now and then, and they don’t need NCA as a crutch for fame.
On another note, I would like to say something about the dear students as well. All they need is an excuse to bunk classes, some are protesting because it seems like the cool thing to do. They want to look politically aware and at best get their picture taken for a well known newspaper And they should get their asses back in class!
I would like to say that this is again only my opinion, I may be wrong. Sir Hasnat is witnessing the whole thing at first hand, and I’m sure he’s the best judge here.
Again, i don’t think it’s wise to assume what the others would have done or not. People act in strange ways when the going gets tough and some handle it with grace and others muck it up.
i would disagree on one thing that you have mentioned: “But Artists, as Artists should not be so dependent on guidance, they should rely on their own judgement and their own good sense”. While that is true to most extent, it doesnt hold much ground because the reason people enroll at NCA is to receive guidance by people and to hone their skills and streamline their efforts. Some of the best artists of today and those of the past, and those around the world actually, owe much to their teachers. One is lucky to have a teacher that inspires them. After college an artist has a lifetime to define or redefine themselves. I’m not saying follow the teachers blindly. I was a rebel most of the time. and did things my way.but i NEVER had a bad relationship with any teacher. Because i understood where they were coming to themselves.
My issues is the student’s needs to identify with a certain type. Inspiration is good enough, hero worship a step too far ahead. and while I can see you admire Naeem Shb and Jamil Baloch (I do too) it’s not fair to say that Maryam’s or Laila’s style is hot air. I have not been taught by either Maryam or Laila so I know i’m not taking sides. but I have met many graduates who owe their development to them.
In my 2nd year painting time (eons and eons ago) we had 6 months of hardcore Naeem Shb, with his technique and discipline and skill oriented teaching. The next 6 months were the oppsite. Quddus shb asking us to dissect ideas, propose installations and do utter madness.
We didnt compare the two. We ACTUALLY trealised how both artists (both successful) had helped us see and develop different sides of our work. We were under no orders to follow them afterwards, but we did draw our own style out of it. Learning entails stepping into unknown territories
So it is VERY IMPORTANT to realise: to each his own.
Don’t judge, don’t compare incomparable situations.
Nothing Learnt is ever wasteful.
Although we’ve side tracked from the issue at hand, but since this is a discussion blog, so I guess I’ll just keep on going.
I worship no heroes, If there is infact a hero that I worship, it would be myself.
Unfortunately in NCA I wasnt taught by either RM Naeem or Jamil Baloch.
Everything learnt is from your own experience. There is a difference between wisdom and knowledge, I thank God that I am fortunate enough to owe nothing to any body.
By modern standards, anything under the sun can be called Art. This is a reasoning that provides many with the courage to display works of inferior aesthetic quality and skill to the public. There is a very heated debate amongst different artists who say that skill is irrelevant and those who recognize its importance. This is probably a result of the works of many artists produced in the West, works by artists such as Picasso, Bacon, Cezanne etc. While they might have actually been creating work that was a reaction to conventions in painting, they had proven their dexterity in their earlier works. It’s funny that Duchamps’ urinal can actually be seen as a critique of the modern artist and I am sure that you can hear him cackling with laughter standing on his grave when people try to imitate his exampleand create (for the lack of a better word) shitty art. Globalization can sometimes be seen as a curse, I do sometimes when I see the people (even faculty members at N.C.A.) come up with the most bizarre specimens of work in the name of modernity and westernization. It somehow becomes acceptable and is even seen as something very intellectual. Why is that, when the work is scarcely even thought provoking, is something I cannot understand. I cannot see somebody’s pain in a vomit of colours on a canvas. I cannot see intellectual maturity in rupee bills pasted side by side and displayed at an art show. I cannot see feminism in dirty sanitary napkins.
Even the most renowned artist had teachers I agree. But those teachers were helping them with their skills. No one can really help you with your ideas, they need to be your own ideas.
As a reaction to this, which is probably the result of some kind of inferiority complex, students of Art in Pakistan are extremely confused. It seems to them that their own thoughts are inferior, and as a result they have stopped thinking. Quoting philosophers (Freud is a favourite) and trying to adopt theories and philosophies that are not your own has become a fashion.
I was once given an assignment by Laila Rahman, we were supposed to write a journal. We could fill it up with anything that entered our heads. To begin with I was a little confused, How can one be asked to write a journal as an assignment. I thought this was a very pseudo thing to be assigned with. But I wrote the journal. I filled it with honesty with all the things that crossed my mind. In the end, she couldn’t handle her own assignment, turns out I was too honest. She told me I had “crossed a line”, and I replied quite honestly that “I wasn’t aware there was a line”. So Laila infact pointed it out, that anything is not Art, and there is infact a line.
I always say that inorder for you to deconstruct, you need to construct something first.
You cannot begin with deconstruction!
Being a witness to all the proceedings of the last two days at college, both from the faculty side and the students’, I partially agree to a number of facts posted here.
Most of the first and second year students dont know the teachers as they mostly teach the senior students, and are relying on the seniors’ opinion about the faculty getting fired. But that doesn’t nullify the support these teachers have, as almost all the students who ever came in contact with these teachers have discovered their value and are willing to make their voices heard. I cant really say for the Fine Arts teachers (even though they are well versed and equipped with most, if not all, of the right ideas about contemporary fine arts) but being Sir Arfan’s and Sir Aqeel’s student and fellow faculty member I can confidently say that students who haven’t had the fortunate occasion of being tutored by them will be suffering from a magnanimous loss. These teachers are literally begged by other “potentially lucrative” universities to join them as faculty members but they have their loyalties with not only the college but also the passion of professing knowledge. Students – both graduated and current- from Fine Arts, Ceramics, Communication Design, etc owe their gratitude to Sir Arfan for being a rare interdisciplinary outlet of the most contemporary and apt ideas that have enlightened many nad made them better artists/designers/architects. Ex graduates from all over the world who heard about this news can not believe the drastic turn of events, and many gathered in support of the teachers as they recognize the possibility of the damage done to Architecture Department and the college. The protest by the teachers (35 of them, from various departments, both permanent and contractual as per the signatures on the Press Statement) acknowledges the students concerns about reinstating the teachers but their agenda is independant of that and a bit varied from the personal causes alone. Education and politics can not and do not compliment each other in any way. In most world class universities around the globe, the latest criteria for teacher evaluation is not the number of papers published,years of practice or maturiy (both in age and experience) but rather how well have they equipped their students to practice their academic learnings, in other words how much they were able to make students learn. These universities make it a point to try their best to induct the best possible faculty and sadly at NCA it has become a trend to take unethical opportunity to destroy careers of people most dedicated to the most primary point of this all : highest standards of education. The stand (from the faculty’s point of view) is neither for the teachers’ return nor against any personage, as most of the Faculty is a witness to the respectful and logical attitude of the dismissed teachers towards Ustaad Bashir, but against the unfairness and lack of transparency of the compromised administrative system that allows such hindrances in the already lagging state of education we are all aware of. The world is moving on, and we try to hold on to ancient ideas that have- no doubt- once served their purpose but are now oboslete. The students have been suffering not only for the two week’s wastage of the precious time when they should be learning new things and polishing their talents but for the last seven/eight years of the induction of unwanted power battles that have not proven once to be beneficial to our college. Lastly, Ustaad Bashir holds immense respect and importance as a world renowned miniaturist. We, as a creative community, owe him alot. But I must ask this question : Does that make him a good academician, lest an administrator? The answer lies in the apparently unprecedented unrest the college faces administratively, the consistently stooping quality of education and the aggravation of the frustrations students have been facing due to an incompetent regressing stance on all creative endeavours.
Thank you everybody for your replies. As I can see, many conflicting views on all side. A lot of MA students are very perturbed about not being able to go to their studios because of the protest. Other students are also reporting similar problems, This is a very harmful turn of events and does not propagate the concerns properly.
However much I disagree with how this is turning out, it is imperative to remember (contracts or no contracts) transparency must be observed in the running of an institution so that students and teachers can seek answers and be satisfied.
I am NOT a personal fan of the teachers who have been ‘let go’. But I know many students who do owe a lot to them for their help and guidance.
Lets see what happens next.
A well written article is not what counts as we have seen for so many times actually. Its the facts that speak for it selve. If Irfan Ghani had done the protest himself and have stood with the students i would have been there too. But they wanted real threat to the weak and quite novice opposition and called for the media and asked few senior students to stand on the main gate to stop anybody entering the college premises whether they were part of it or not. This is not MAO college or Dhial Singh college. Enough is enough. You talk about transparency and democracy. This is what you came up with when the crucial time came. You became a ghunda of mao and dial singh. What respect and what education you are talking about here! And what kind of higher standards of leadership you are giving to your students. To bully their juniors however they like. That was never the spirit of nca.
@ (Arsalan) good writing skills won’t get you much here. Facts are quite darker than your enlightened report.
i pretty much agree with Hasnat!! the seniors standing at the gate and misbehaving with teachers/.students is not happening!! and i agree… why are teachers not protesting with the students at the gate? why are they having tea party in the canteen.. having hot discussions! pathetic*
im sorry i was there and i didn’t not witness any misbehaving towards any teacher or otherwise ,as for sir hasnat he should really point the finger else where as we’ve all seen today how much of a “decent gentle man” he is .
I am sorry guys I am not the one with ‘good writing skills’ and not associated with NCA any more. But I have spent 5 years at NCA, couple of years with its theatre department and couple of years in RPC. And its been again couple of years I am out of that place. Hope at least Hasnat bhai remember me. I have seen two principals in office, Sajida very strong administrator, intelligent and the one who can foresee ‘future’ and Nazish who could not even see what was going on under her own nose, (this is by the way my personal observation) and among faculty I know only two types FIRST who mediocre, corrupt and hardly involved in anything which is beneficial for students and/or NCA and SECOND people who are only concerned with students, either in class or outside. I really respect second type, though some of them are very good teachers and some are not very good. Only students can decide it, and they do, whenever given opportunity, in shape of “student’s evaluation” or otherwise. Who are these FIRST type people, every one who spent couple of years in NCA in any capacity can tell, but no one confronts them from faculty coz most of the SECOND type people are like “sanu ki lagay” type. At least I don’t recall a single event when any faculty member even stood for the rights of students. In past six years there were many who were kicked out even people like Saroosh after serving for years but whenever it happened there was no response from the faculty except sitting at canteen and telling other faculty member “yaar bari ziadati hoi uss kay saath”. And Hasnat do you seriously think if students were not protesting and only these four persons were you and any other faculty member should have joined them? I really doubt it.
And about students, when did last time NCA students protested for getting their teacher back? I don’t recall even such event. NO one can use them for their own agenda, coz they are more intelligent then we think. No student took risk of ‘protesting’ for ma’m Malhi, but for Maryam, Arfan and Aqeel they did. We have to think what makes a final year student put his/her future at stake in last six months of his degree? Taking panga with mad people like Bashir sahib (I am sorry respect his art though) is not easy thing for a student? I bet no faculty member can mobilize them unless they know very clearly that he don’t have a hidden agenda. If you don’t believe try it 😀
and by the way its now faculties responsibility to bring NCA on right track. And make it a better place for students. Institute which can provide better quality education for middle class students of this nation. Institute which is corruption free and every thing is done on merit. Merit for every one, from student’s admission to hiring faculty, every thing on merit.
So are you as faculty member willing to step forward? Or do you want students to do that? If you don’t then let it become another Punjab University or BNU 😦
i second that and support the betterment of our college
Dearest S.A.
I feel this as my obligation to inform you of today’s turn of events that made the situation clearer than ever. An independent student meeting took place at 10.30 am and the perturbed students voiced their confusions regarding the stance of the teachers and the senior students alike. In the process of that meeting, Mr. Hasnat himself turned up and tried to call the first year students back to class. The situation was not witnessed by me personally but what was apparent is the fact that NONE of the students complied to the genuinely concerned request by Mr. Hasnat (I agree with him on the aspect of resumption of the classes). The senior students objected to the intrusion and later on commented that the students be given complete right to gather and talk about their matters peacefully. Since most of the students were not satisfied by the response of the senior students, a formal request to ALL faculty members was made as an attempt to put all the conflicting sides to explain themselves and to reconcile, once and for all. Almost all the faculty and the students showed up around 1 pm in the auditorium, all except the most important and elusive figure in the whole scenario, Ustaad Bashir. Nevertheless the discussion took off with the students presiding and putting their questions, concerns and hopes forth. They demanded a number of things that are:
– the undeniable existence of the lobbies be crushed
– student body be allowed to elect their representatives
– the teachers be reinstated, at the same time assuring a foolproof criteria for the procedure of dismissal/induction of any new or old faculty members
– system of negotiations for the above stated purposes be made transparent.
Various teachers responded to clarify the situation, while debate between the registrar (the representative of the Principal) and the teachers proceeded in an acceptable fashion. Furthermore the protesting teachers acknowledged the fact that all the four teachers are reinstated but the three point agenda is still not fulfilled as the authenticity of the current Principal’s capacity to run this college was questioned and the demand for the removal was made publicly. In response to that the students showed unanimous support for the reinstated teachers, and condemned the suggestion of “letting go”, like we have been doing since ages, and accepting the course of life as it is. Mr Hasnat made a valid point as he expressed his opinion that all the principals ever selected have been politically inclined and nothing can be done about it because we have a President and Prime Minister who are corrupt and unlawful, but he was not coherent enough and the students retaliated by stating that they would not just sit and let their fate be decided by political scuffles that never involve them or any other sincere person in the process. The position of the front lined candidates for the Principal’s post was questioned too, while the teachers stated that these candidates should dissolve all the personal differences and start over again with the principal’s appointment process making clear that the dubious nature of the selection process since the last two years calls for such a radical reconciliation. The candidates responded to the questions asked by the students regarding their vision about the college and demanded presentations for it, but it was a sad occasion to witness the “99.9 % confirmed” next principal’s, Sir Zafar Iqbal, view of the college in the next five/ten years as he had no concrete ideology to relieve the college of its current predicament, both academically and administratively. Discussions continued about the various issues students are facing, including the dilapidated living conditions of hostel, bus routes, study trips, academic quality and the complete disregard for the teacher evaluation (done by the students) which is in itself the proof of the caliber of the teachers under the axe. An unpredictable scenario was witnessed as after the two and a half hours of the discussion a few final year students who were influential in the organization of the protests confessed that they have been approached by Sir Zafar Iqbal with an offer to stop the protests and in return be given favourable result in the final thesis juries as well as guaranteed posts for them as teaching associates after graduation. They also mentioned the unofficial knowledge Mr. Zafar had about the result of the selection of the principal which raised more questions about the transparency of the college’s governing system. Students were seen celebrating, after the meeting, the return of their teachers, whereas the teachers made solemn guarantees of resuming the classes and fighting for the cause with whatever it takes, if not guaranteeing its fulfillment.
I feel it my responsibility to state that the students behaved themselves amazingly well, and were passionate about their cause. I believe that some students were stopped from entering college by their seniors, and that is wrong and not justified in any manner except if one understands the nature of the senior junior relationship at our college. As to the question Maria put forth about the teachers not protesting with the students is that the protests were initiated independently by the teachers and the students on their own accord and deliberately no efforts were made to combine both these protests as the agenda varied. The students were addressing the Principal, while the teachers do not recognize him as the controlling authority and their demands were addressed to the Board of Governors. I would state it again : This college needs to get rid of the useless lobby wars, and we should strive together – with differences left at the door – to accomplish an almost impossible but achievable task of firstly catching up with the academic caliber world over by assuring a fair and transparent procedure that guarantees the best outcome of this college.
Thank you so much for this detailed account of the meeting Arsalan. I think this was needed now.
But it sounds like the troubles aren’t over. mainly because: well they never are. I just hope that college resumes with its regular studies and the issues are genuinely addressed.
as for the principal’s post – over the past 2 years there has been way too much confusion and instability regarding the post and due to outside interference proper procedures have not been followed. It’s time they be implemented so that at least the one major issue is resolved.
I just hope the students keep their respect for ALL the teachers involved on BOTH sides.
Saira whether you agree with me on the whole students protest or not, is your own affair. I will have to correct you at one point though. I wasn’t talking in clichés. I wasn’t talking about how students respond to the “poor kids” and I wasn’t saying the “burger kids” are bad.
I was telling you about my own experience, where teachers made that distinction. Since everyone seems to have missed my point, I will clear it out once again. I think it is unfair that certain teachers give the “poor kid” preferential treatment and certain teachers think that they are just idiots because they can’t articulate a sentence in English. I was speaking against both the orientalist and the colonial way of looking at this.
M. I will not respond to what you have said. An angry mob has no name; you can therefore remain comfortably anonymous. If it takes courage to protest, then I hope that by the time you graduate, you will have acquired some.
The problems that everyone seems to be having is with the “system”. And that is people and their colonial attitude. Protest if you must. But then aim your guns in the right direction too. Target all the culprits instead of just some of them. This country was made and is run by bounty hunters. There, I said it! I think it’s even more defeatist to think that if you protested against Zardari (which makes more sense) you would achieve nothing. I was being more Robespierre about the whole thing, if anything.
Awais, thanks for clearing it out. 🙂
“Maryam Hussain( i respect her and i would vote for her to be back), Leila Rehman and Hareem Tanveer were brought in by Naazish Atta Ullah and there were people kicked out in her term too. Nobody protested for those people who were kicked out in her term. One of your friends was i suppose more deserving at that point for the post Hareen Tanvir was appointed!”
This is what u said, what faculty faculty did for them? Question of students protesting comes later, don’t you see students don’t protest for everyone, they are vigilant enough to make their own decision, and they did this time.
NCA students, I salute you.
yes true!
what arslan ! has said is absolutely the on dot detail of what really happened as for the earlier encounter of sir hasnat it was not pleasant! it was sickening to see how the teachers who are there to mold us in better humans were behaving again ! alot of blame game drama was goiing on as for sir hasnat i have a question ! why did you flee the meeting why did you not sit and saw it to the end !WHY did YOU not answer our questions! isn’t THAT your RESPONSIBILITY as an educator ! if you think our loyalties lie on the wrong end then should they have been with zulfiqar iqbal and he is such a fine specimen isn’t he ?
Reading the article by Ma’am Saira and the followup comments i feel tempted to add my comment and thought about the issue as i was a witness and part of all the protest and have family relations with one of those teacher.Here’s a deal with the matter:
1. It is good that student stood up united and protested for a cause, shows that Pakistani youth still has some energy left.
2. The problem remains with the stance of the protest! This does not make a stance that a few teachers’ contracts were not renewed, but we still need the teachers back. A better stance would have been : we need a permanent principal; we need a principal who is appointed on the basis of merit only and the process is transparent; its been almost 6 months since the college has been given university status, we need the university rules applicable. All the above mentioned reasons were the core reasons for the protest but students trying to cover the real issues with an issue of teachers being fired was not a very strong stance.
3. I talked to a few seniors, who repeatedly said that these were good teachers and we need them back and that we will not stop the protest until we dont get them reinstated. The fact remains, this fight is not about some two three teachers. it will continue happened. The politics will be there. We need a change in the system and that can only be possible if we know what to change in the system. This change has to be rules and regulations and transparency.
4. The positive point is: It is good to keep the energy of the youth alive. if we are protesting against one wrong thing now, we might stand up for other wrong things as well. this way we’ll learn about organized protests and effective protests. All this learning is very very very vital for a youth which has been dead since the reign of Zia-ul-Haq.
so, Instead of snubbing the first years from protesting (as done by sir hasnat and sir mohsin) it would be good if they tell their students that it was good that u protested, shows u are a living nations but the protest would have been on more solid grounds. That would have been something!
Let’s keep a look at the flaws of the protest but at the end i dont think we should avoid appreciating because its not about some protest only, its about the fact that breathing and concerned nations know how to keep the energy of their youth alive.
INSHALLAH VERY SOON PERMANENT AND MERIT BASE PRINCIPAL WILL BE SELECTED SUPPORTR US STAND WITH US………. THNX
I am one of the students who took part of the protest. I think that it is unfair to assume that the teachers who lost their jobs were somehow behind the students actions, or faculty members on one side of the situation are pushing us to do this. It is also not correct to say that the students didn’t even know why they were protesting. There was certainly some confusion as to how these events had transpired, and questions about what actually lead up to the dismissal of the concerned teachers. We demanded clarity, and answers to our questions. We did know that the actions that had taken place regarding this matter were illegal, and this is what we were protesting. There were many more complaints that were voiced today regarding college/hostel maintenance, the fees and so on. We were commenting on the general state of the system and how there is a dire need for improvement because it is our right to be educated in a positive environment in which there is a continual effort at development, free from these political games.
I believe that the meeting was a success, and the students organized it well. Plus, this morning in the meeting, it was said several times that those who must attend their classes can leave, and are more than welcome to participate in the meeting later. I didn’t see anyone being forced to stay in the auditorium. I also believe there is no point in saying that students who haven’t been taught by these teachers shouldn’t have participated, because each teacher has something to offer, and the students are being deprived of the chance to learn from them.
We are all adults and have a will of our own. Nobody has instructed us to think or act in a particular way. It is high time to bring up these issues, and I do not believe that it was done badly at all. Even if there was some rowdiness (which I did not witness), overall the protest was quite peaceful and the students were very clear about their demands.
Also, the comments about Miss Maryam or Miss Laila being certain ‘types’ of teachers (good at English and so on) is very much besides the point! So is their teaching methodology. (And so what if they’re bi-lingual? I don’t understand how this is a justifiable criticism. In universities around the world, this is considered a plus point because the teacher is able to communicate more effectively with his/her students, therefore, it is these people who are hired more frequently.) It is a reality of our world in any case, that getting jobs in any field is highly competitive, and it’s usually the more qualified who get them.
Our protest was not just a stand for 3 or 4 specific people. This is not about who is ‘contemporary’ or who is a ‘traditionalist’, but about having a system that is transparent and works for the improvement of our education. We are critical of the illegal processes that took place that lead to the teachers’ dismissal, and of how a corrupt and inefficient system has allowed for many injustices to take place, in particular, the students’ right to have a much better education and environment than they have been given. The time to voice these issues was long overdue, so we should not be criticized for doing this in the first place, or the way it was handled either. A very significant dialogue has been initiated, and this is how change will take place, not by writing letters to people who we will never see or hear from, or by doing absolutely nothing.
I don’t know how should i put it all together now. Quite a day. In the morning i went to auditorium to ask the students if they were not meeting with faculty as they changed the time, to come to the studio for drawing class. They said we are having a student body meeting instead. Then i asked them who was behind stopping the students from entering the premises, they(student body) became quite violent looking and loud and said that they did not stop them and everybody was there on their own. And i asked them if they had gone to see Principal sahib to demand anything, they said we won’t talk to you. Then i left the audi and went to drawing studio.
When first year students came to studio after the meeting i asked them what had been told to them by the student body, they said they were briefed about what kind of issues students are facing in the college where they pay funds in the fees in the name of student guild and that guild is never there at the first place. And quite a few other things about students but nothing related to the affairs of the teachers for whom they were protesting earlier…….
[alright. Now (the Master Puppeteer) had changed the whole thing and decided to have another story thrown in pressurizing the administration and saying students were only protesting for their own rights and not for the staff being kicked out.]*
now i asked them why they were protesting outside the college on the first day. They said they were mostly stopped to enter the premises by seniors. Then i asked if they really knew who these teachers were whose contracts didn’t get renewed this time. Few had seen Irfan Ghani in the admission interview. Otherwise they didn’t know the other guys.
I talked to them about the situation a little bit and told them to open their eyes and question where necessary. And don’t let anybody else speak for them.
And in the audi meeting today it was quite sad to see that Bashir Ahmed didn’t show up. As i had expected to hear the real story from both sides once and for all. But that never happened. We only heard the story from one side as usual. And that story seems to be quite exaggerated to me.
In the audi meeting with students and faculty i was overwhelmed by the musings of the Irfan Ghani and his contractual friends. They prepared and orchestrated the whole event quite well and things went in their way as i had predicted earlier. But i as an independent faculty member(as politics is the way here) was not happy at their winning. So i made few statements and asked some questions.
First of all i asked the students again about stoping of students outside the gate and students body reply was that they did an illegal thing and they are sorry for it.
[Good. if you say sorry after i implored then its not a sorry, its a crime!!]*
Maryam Hussain telling students that we should be getting rid of Bashir and should get somebody who does not have a political background and is not corrupt should serve as principal.
I raised my concerns over that and said that its not possible in this country with the same people sitting in the higher authorities. And every individual stuck in the contacts game.
Then Irfan Sahib saying that we are not a lobby and all of us don’t belong to any lobby.
I questioned and said if you say so then was it possible for Maryam, Leila, Hareem and Lali to be given contracts in Naazish Atta Ullah’s period if there was no lobby and favoritism.
Her answer: Oh i have gotten scholarships from 16-25. And Naazish had created those contractual jobs.
And leila saying, i would show my credentials to you and you should show yours to mine. (loud clapping)
[Sorry maryam and leila, that was not my question.
You guys didn’t give an answer to my question. And if Naazish Atta Ullah as a principal can create those jobs then how is it not possible for any other principal to terminate/null them through his/her power? which you guys from the start were saying is illegal]*
I was not speaking for anybody there. I was just being the guy who had enough courage to speak when most of the faculty barred themselves from saying anything for anything. Except clapping or whistling or silently witnessing it.
I can’t be bully like others i suppose. And by the way when i had raised these questions, you should have seen their faces.
the parts in brackets were not said in the auditorium.*
And whoever you are wart! I have actually witnessed the faces of these people from too close today while sitting in the auditorium chair, you guys were praising to death. And i am sorry to say i am still not with them. I smell foulness everywhere.
I am sorry Hasnat! but you do realise that you portray a rather innocent picture of yourself. To correct you… “they(student body) became quite violent looking and loud and said that they did not stop them and everybody was there on their own.” it was you who screamed at everyone .. and accused people that Oh you took pictures of this and that person. You literally kept on shouting for a rather long time without realising that you were destroying your image and making fun of your own self by going on about it.
You go on about how there are no politics going on… but it seems you reallllyyyy hate Marium Hussain… Please note that students stood up for her. If anything happens to you (God Forbid) do not expect the student body to do the same for you, thanks to your rather amusing, entertaining and stupid behaviour today.
and oh pleaseee… “I can’t be bully like others i suppose. And by the way when i had raised these questions, you should have seen their faces.” It was your face that was rather amusing…. 🙂
and yes… I think everyone will like to know and see your files.
and oh I think you forgot to mention that you left in the middle when you realised that you have ridiculed yourself enough! so please snap out of your little bubble. thank you!
Wow Sir Hasnat ,
With all due respect , I don’t know what you have against these 4 teachers, but whatever it is, It is serious.
What I witnessed today and even through this thread, is that you have constantly been “sarcastic” , “taunting” & “accusing” through out.
You say you want to be away from this politics but every single word that you utter smells of it .
“I can’t be bully like others i suppose. And by the way when i had raised these questions, you should have seen their faces.”
What were you trying to this morning then? when you tried targeting a student? took his picture? and threatened him? WASNT THAT BULLYING?
You have no idea how these teachers & especially Sir Arfan has affected every single person he has ever come to teach & this is when you realise how little you are in front of his vast knowledge & experience. So you can call him a Master Puppet , or an idle man who sits in the canteen , or a ghunda…
These two days were a witness of how students of NCA will always have his back .
Its a two way traffic you see.
You cannot force someone to respect you, you have to earn it .
Oh and even besides today, I have seen you many times being rude to students. Just trying to say, us students arn’t blindfolded , we follow those who respect & care for us and our well being .
adding something more… I am witness to you saying… “oh in jaisay canteen teachers tou aur bohat aa jaye gaye”….
Wow Sir Hasnat ,
With all due respect , I don’t know what you have against these 4 teachers, but whatever it is, It is serious.
What I witnessed today and even through this thread, is that you have constantly been “sarcastic” , “taunting” & “accusing” through out.
You say you want to be away from this politics but every single word that you utter smells of it .
“I can’t be bully like others i suppose. And by the way when i had raised these questions, you should have seen their faces.”
What were you trying to this morning then? when you tried targeting a student? took his picture? and threatened him? WASNT THAT BULLYING?
You have no idea how these teachers & especially Sir Arfan has affected every single person he has ever come to teach & this is when you realise how little you are in front of his vast knowledge & experience. So you can call him a Master Puppet , or an idle man who sits in the canteen , or a ghunda…
These two days were a witness of how students of NCA will always have his back .
Its a two way traffic you see.
You cannot force someone to respect you, you have to earn it .
Oh and even besides today, I have seen you many times being rude to students. Just trying to say, us students arn’t blindfolded , we follow those who respect & care for us and our well being ..
I think you’ve misunderstood what Miss Laila and Miss Maryam were saying. You were accusing them of getting their positions based on favouritism, and they were saying that they got them based on their credentials. Plus, there is absolutely no proof that these people (or anyone really) have gotten their positions through some kind of favouritism. These are only speculations made by people observing the situation, and perhaps not having a hand in the outcome. However, this does not mean that favouritism etc. does not exist, it certainly does, but for now, these comments are too personal and are addressing an incident that took place some time ago, for which we don’t have any information from reliable sources and we are not aware of how those proceedings were conducted. This pointing fingers and so on is not helpful.
sir hasnat,
with due respect, the protest was not for the teachers only why are you not addressing other issues the one we all raised today you didn’t even write about them!!about the lockers our fees and the funds along with the parking which no one of us know about.where as the lobbies are concerned that’s something you and sir masud hamid gave us a proof of while we took your drawing classes. who was affected then WE were!!!you came late at times yet got all the money you deserved but we could not learn better because we never knew who to ask what!!! we don’t care who these teachers are and even if its you who is illegally fired we’ll fight ( if we’ll know about it)
where do i stand what am i paying for and what will i take from the NCA!!! i dun see my future bright seriously for 2nd yr fine arts we had a junior teacher taking OUR drawing during our 1st term.90% students flunked in ART HISTORY including the bright students with a record of assignments and quiz average above 50 and our beloved lecturer did not even know about it she was asking the TAs and the TA said she doesn’t know about it. im sorry to say this but you your self have been bias you always had discussions with the girls and boys with the elites and had a healthy relation sip with them but the student from a normal middle class suffered a girl wearing a duppata is called a bib (in the most embarrassing and taunting behavior). why is this difference!! you talk about the !st years we had the bus fee issue from a 1st year whom we did not named secondly a girl from 1st year was failed in 6 subjects even after having a good academic record and when she goes to a senior teacher what she asks her to do is stay shut or they’ll disqualify you!!!!!
sorry sir but what i can see is all you teachers are focusing on accusing each other *apna apna number bananay main zor* where are We!!! 1st years and 2nd years went for their own betterment if our seniors not only the one who are protesting but the ones who passed out are saying that these teachers are competent then how can we trust you teachers who hardly stop making fun of each other.we respect and love all our teachers we want them to do the same!!
yes… where is your Panache now Hasnat ???
i hereby commend mr hasnat mehmood’s bravery and courage for not only speaking at the meeting but at this forum allowing ppl to make a complete *** out of him..
need i say more?
i hope the satire comes through..
I actually do feel that it is courageous of Hasnat to use this forum to voice his opinions. While I agree with the stance of the students to quite an extent, I must point out that all sides must be listened to. Hasnat has a strong opinion, just like all of you d,o and he is willing to listen to what is being said back.
EVERYBODY Please lets keep the anger channelled to the debate and not go towards bringing his wife and child into this. It is completely unacceptable to launch personal attacks, no matter how right or justified your anger might be.
I am loving it. Please carry on. I can see the reports taken by seniors of the class i took today and i should have made a video of that too i wish. So everybody could see for themselves what did i tell them and what was the discussion about.
And this hopeless person trying to cheat here, talking as if he is a first year student then becoming a second year student in the second paragraph and trying insulting Atteqa now. Quite a blame game you guys have come up with. Stop coming here with fake names and come with your name and say something on record rather than blaming me for something i have not done.
I am an independent observer like any anchor in a discussion who points out the faults done by both parties. And tells them where they are going wrong.
If you knew anything i also went to Murtaza Jafri’s office after i left audi and said to him that he and the Registrar should be there in the audi to answer the questions to which they said that they had said enough.
And if you think guys that i would refrain myself now by reporting the other side of the story by your blame game then you guys are wrong. And this is becoming more and more clear whats going on in here.
And by the way when you started your protest there was nothing about your rights and your lockers anywhere. All the pictures of the incident on the first day do tell us that. The banner on the main gate said “Ehtajaj barai Bahaliah ustadza” Did i miss anything you want to show me?
Am i wrong again or did i not see something??
What is really a shame here is that instead of being a helpful part of this process, you are doing your best to discourage the students, and attempting to prove that you are right and everyone else is wrong. Why don’t you understand that this is not a personal war, this is a collective one against a corrupt system, not a little battle in which we can make clever comments to show that we can outsmart each other in an argument. It is amazing that finally, the students have united against certain wrongs, which is what this country desperately needs. This deserves encouragement, enough of this “I, I, I, me, me, me’
Agreed a 100%
with due respect u stole the sculpter of 3rd year student who is going for fir on u sir hassnat chor kaun ha ya bohat juld pata chal jaey ge so sweete pora pakistan corrupt ha lekan chor ni……………………………………..i yhink aqal mand k leay ishara he kafi hota ha
mr hasnat it is acceptable that you type ur words urself..
here lies a dead donkey.
please talk about lions:)
Mr. Hasnat,
Without even touching your stance for the moment, I would like to add that there are respectable and peaceful ways to state your opinion and shouting your throat hoarse in front of hundreds of students unfortunately isn’t one of them. I’m sorry I can not respect someone who loses their temper so whimsically.
Coming to your stance, the first years may have been stopped from entering the college premises by some seniors, I admit. But unfortunately, that only happened because we do not have a student representative body which would elect responsible representatives who were held accountable for their actions. Discarding the entire protest on the basis of that is too simplistic and fails to account for hundreds of students who wanted to peacefully voice their opinions. Moreover, I am not sure exactly how forcefully or for how long students were stopped at the gate because I personally know people who were in college all day because they insisted upon being let in. Did your first year students insist? I mean if they really didn’t want to protest, they should have. Unfortunately for you, many of them were swayed by the information they received at the gate and willfully decided to stand outside in protest. You accused the seniors of hiding in the wing of the first years. But if admittedly first years weren’t allowed inside the premises, why were they holding banners outside till the protest concluded? I could see no chains.
The point you raised in the auditorium today, that in our times and our country a non political principal is an impossible feat, is again too simplistic. Such conversation belongs to the drawing rooms of pseudo intellectuals and we all have an idiot box with a healthy dosage of Geo to satisfy our need for self pity. The logic behind such statements is intrinsically flawed. Never-has-been is no reason for never-will-be. Rather, never-has-been rightly gives birth to it’s-about-time sentiment. If you really are as hopeless as you sound, I fear for the world you want to raise your kids in.
As far as your accusations about lobbyists are concerned, I would like to inform you, because you clearly weren’t listening properly, that the students are equally concerned. That is why the meeting was called. We do not want to be used, even inadvertently, as a stepping stone for any personal agendas. If you have any concrete evidence of such lobbying, you should have spoken up instead of passing immature sweeping statements about the credentials of the said teachers. Just saying that one side was more convincing than the other because it was ‘orchestrated’ is really too low a blow. I don’t think extensive rehearsals can transform the wrong to right magically. Pixie dust maybe, but not rehearsals.
Having said that, we the students know the influence the said teachers have over some of us who are more impressionable than others. That is why we are wary and are demanding a student organization that would consult the student body at every stage. We understand that we have a set of demands and that our teachers have a set of demands. Somewhere, these demands coincide and we are ready to stand by the teachers. At others, they may be completely different in which case we will not support the faculty, rest assured. Of course to implement this, I can not stress enough on the importance of a student organization that can quantify student opinion objectively so we know where the opinions of the majority lie.
As far as Maryam Hussain’s demand of ousting the acting principal is concerned, the student body as a whole has not indicated their support or condemnation. It is a demand from the teachers because they believe that a criminal offense was committed when he bypassed the BoG to issue these letters. If someone has violated the laws of the land, then certainly he can not head an educational institution. We agree to that in principle but we are waiting for to hear the court verdict because he is most certainly innocent until proven guilty. Therefore, the sequence of events is that first the courts must deliver their verdict on the basis of which we will decide our stance.
A case could’ve been made for the victimization of Bashir Sahab, if only he was duly present to be victimized. We really did not victimize his absence.
In light of all the above points, it would be nice to see a teacher like you display some faith in your students rather than dismissing us too quickly as imbeciles who do not know better. A political struggle will eventually invariably become somewhat of a spectacle but that is no reason to withdraw your support from the principles in question.
🙂
you make me laugh mr.hasnat i had no teachers ,i had no one to answer my queries im paying good money to feed your son’s education,so what i get in return is of no consequence ? transparent system that we have been demanding from day one is of absolutely no consideration,lets keeping banging our heads in the wall because you are telling us so! you really expect us to expect han ji teachers mill gaey hain! ab idiots ki tarahan tobara baith jao! .
quick question shouldn’t you have come back once you ran off to be the king of justice !
as for the video don’t worry it’ll be up soon =D cheers mate !
hehe yea im lying i know we’ll have a new meeting we respect mam atiqa but the truth is the truth ask her yourself 😀 i know if she never lies you’ll be embarrassed and what do you have to do with my name i am a part of the student body is that not enough for you to know if you were a good teacher you would have been ashamed of what your saying and get an answer for what questions i have asked you..instead of calling the students who are asking you our so called ROHANI BAAPS for justice CHEATERs you should have went through the records to check the details ask the 1st year what i said ask the second year the same!!!
and yes the teachers sitting in the canteen were at least available in the college and we were always welcomed by them whereas you left on time i-e 2 :30 🙂
i feel sorry for us NCAites 😦 we seriously have no future 😦
please change ur name from hopeless to hopefull!
and thank you yes we stand under the name student body..
i am a witness. students were misbehaving at the gate. anyways thats another story and THAT IS NOT THE REAL ISSUE!!.. i think its useless to talk about it at this point. i am just waiting for Bashir Sahab to talk.. i really want to know what he has to say… there must be something! i m sure he ll come up valid points.. but i am glad. college is open now and we can WORK! yayy**
What happened in the last two days is nothing short of a revolution! No body in their careers at NCA have witnessed anything like that. Never in the history of this place, students prevailed so democratically and so peacefully over the affairs of college administration. So, I think, the students have put their act together. However, before the dust begins to settle, the NCA student body must take the opportunity to organize itself by reviving NCA Student Guild. Hold a general body meeting of all students to ratify the constitution of Guild with two third majority. Hold Election, Chose Office bearers and then start cracking. Once the students have a democratic space to express their concerns about quality of education to facilities provided by the college administration, a feedback system of complaint and redressel, the tyranny of teachers over students at NCA will be weakened. And teachers will become more accountable to their students as part of their professional merit.
For teachers, there is a need to re-start the process of NCA Staff Association, and NCA faculty needs to attend to an unfinished business here.
Irrespective of the fact that who got appointed how, I must say that Acting principal has proved himself to be a worst administrators on all accounts. Since students body is generally not in interaction with this fellow, they have little idea of his poor administrative abilities, and deep seated inferiority complex bred by years of servitude at NCA. The poor man has been oppressed for so long by his peers that he has taken it on himself to destroy the very institution that raised him. This is a psychological profile that i am describing here, which should not be read as a character assassination. Everybody respects him for reviving miniature department…
Among, many other things, did any body noticed that NCA had not yet advertised for the next year’s admission, when every other institution in the whole country have had them. What kind of crop you expect next year, when the best among the potential students of NCA have already been taken by other institution? This is only one example of bad administration that is cited as an example and people can multiply them.
Students and teachers need to continue their vigil over college administration and hopefully good times are coming very soon!
s.a
first of all let me thank you for giving us this forum and let me actually thank Sir Hasnat for voicing his side here, for such dialogue is not only healthy but the need of the moment. However having said that reading this entire discussion is rather saddening. As it was to have to go through the occurrences of the past few days . (yes i am well versed in English but please do not hold that against me, i am sorry that my school taught me well, taught be independent thought and taught me to speak out my voice. had it been by choice rather than my parents i would have gone to a school where i would have been left ill versed and would actually not have been able to voice my concern on the world wide web that uses this language. i would also have had my thought controlled and dictated and would not have learnt to voice my opinion. this is what i would have wanted but sadly my parents made this decision for me. In the future i will try to unlearn this language because it seems that my knowledge of this language might make others believe that i wish to deceive others through words. so i apologize for my good English at the very start).
i would first like to clarify one point. for todays meeting a letter was sent to the principal in the morning requesting him to come. However there were some considerations to be taken care of regarding the timing of the meeting so it was rescheduled for 1, but most of the student body could not be informed in time of this change resulting in some confusion and unpleasantness. It was also cc’d to all HOD and faculty members requesting their presence as well. So really everyone was called to tell us their side and point of view. that is why the meeting was called in the first place. However at the time of the meeting five key persons did not come upon the decided time. At which point we went personally and called them there only because we wanted to know with earnest what they had to say. I must say that on our personal request they went and talked to the principal and came after they had discussed the matter. The principal could not come because he was feeling unwell and his sugar was low. i would never hold matters of health against a person so if he could not come i understand completely, however after that discussion, brief as it was, he did send four people to be there in the auditorium to give us a complete picture. these four persons being the registrar Nadeem sahab, and the three faculty members currently in the process of selection for principal i.e Sir maqsood pasha, Sir Zafar Iqbal, and Sir Murtaza Jafri.So at this point i would like to say that one cannot say that only one side was present. At the start of the meeting these four persons after consultation with the Principal had come, whether they left in the middle or not is another matter. i would like to say that Nadeem sahab at first left after his brief comments but on our second request the Principal, Bashir sahab again very kindly sent him there instead because of his poor health after which he stayed till the end of the proceedings.Sir Murtaza Jafri as Sir Hasnat said sadly left. Sir Pasha and Sir Zafar remained with us till the end. So really it was ensured that all concerned were present and once inside the auditorium it was ensured personally by the students that all faculty members were heard.
Here i bring in a second point. whereas it would be made out to those who were not there that only the four persons discharged spoke and instigated the students i would say that is incorrect. I will count out all faculty members who spoke to the student body today, whether their remarks short or long. Apart from the registrar; from the faculty the four discharged teachers spoke ofcourse, namely Sir Arfan, Sir Aqeel, Ma’am Laila and Ma’am Mariam, along with this, Sir Sajjad Kausar HOD archietcure spoke, Sir Zafar from multimedia, Sir Murtaza Jafri from FA, Sir Hasnat from FA, Ma’am, Nausheen from FA, Sir Quddus from FA, Sir Salman from architecture and Ma’am Iram Zia, HOD Textile design spoke from her seated position. these are all plain facts that i am stating. However these should show to any impartial observer that really apart from the four discharged a number of faculty members spoke from the various departments of the College. So to say that the event was orchestrated from some one side and that the other side was maligned there by the four discharged would really be unfair. because really apart from the Principal there were others there on the administrations behalf. we will not hold a persons ill health against him and if he was unable to come we accept that because he kindly sent others on his behalf instead.
Thirdly as has been made out by others and Sir Hasnat that the students were divided or that people were held against their will and that people have by saying sorry implicated themselves in a crime might be one part of the thing. But Sir Hasnat (and i address u here since you may be the only faculty member i can address here) more than the students what was very visible today was the division between the teachers. the students had at the start requested that there be no clapping or jeering or cutting off of another persons speech and whereas at first the student body followed this request it was the faculty that broke this decorum and not just the four discharged but others as well and we are witness to that. Is it not sad that you say we held other students against their will against their rights when you sat there maligning other teachers (whether truthfully or not i do not argue), you said that their posting had been unfair, you blamed the ex principal Ma’am Naazish of unjust hiring, you were cut short in your own argument by Sir Murtaza Jafri (even though understandably he was emotional at the point) and you sat there heaping allegations just as everyone else did. You say there are lobbies and puppet masters then would twelve faculty members speak and malign others so openly, each pitted against the other whereas the rest jeered, laughed and clapped at the unseemly spectacle! We all sat there and witnessed a divided teaching staff. the students might be confused,maybe misled by here-say (from both sides) might have acted wrongly at times (and they have admitted it as you yourself said) yet the teachers were in disarray, there might be lobbies (one cannot deny nor insist) yes but there were others who spoke there as well. And if anything by the end it was clear how worried, confused and wanting in desperation a fair system the faculty itself was, across the board, not just the four discharged. we have all witnessed this ugly site and this is what the students could see before and fear. We are not led by any persons or person or puppet master one way or another, we are led by our united belief that if affairs stay as they stand we fear this institutions future is at stake. if u sit in your high chair heaping insults and accusations on others u will be fearful to see below u that u sit on the funeral pyre of this institution that has been built by countless and taken forward by numerous others. That is why we the students protested and implored the faculty and administration to listen to us. not because we were led by the four discharged or any other persons or body, not because a senior told a junior or a junior told a senior, not because we were forced to stay outside by some person but rather because we see a crumbling tower collapsing under its own weight. If you are an impartial observer and a concerned faculty member i implore you to look into all the matters discussed yesterday and raised over the past three days, rather then blame the discharged teachers, or a lobby, or a student who protested, or a student who stopped others at the gate. Let us not play the blame game, whether students or faculty, and look at all that has transpired and what has been building up for more than a month or a year even. You asked the first years whether they knew these teachers, whether they knew what the protest about and as you say some of them did not know; i ask does it not strike you that these first years stayed outside to save their institution and its independence yet you who have been there for all these years cannot see all this. the question is not about who forced who, or who influenced who, or who is from what lobby. the question is what are we going to do about all this, because where matters stand has been made clear to all of us after this meeting. As ugly as it was it was necessary, if only for this. And Sir i say to you as i say to all other the only way forward is united and with dialogue and with transparency between all us concerned. so please do not blame students and heap one allegation against them after another (true or false as i said we cannot say) rather be with them. And i ask the same of the students to not heap allegations but rather move forward together. for there is no other way forward. let the process for selecting a principal start again with transparency. let the students form a guild and the teachers form a staff association so that opinions are heard through the proper channels. Let us all ensure together that each others voice will be heard. Let us find a way forward together with transparency. that is at heart the goal that we ALL cherish and are working for.
At the end i would say to all those who read this whether you believe these to be the ramblings of an idiot or the hollow rhetoric of a puppet or just the musings of an idealistic fool, read these words carefully and then decide for yourself what you wish to do, whether to play this blame game endlessly or to come together and fight for that which is the right of all through transparent and just means.
I think Awais that I can boast of a similar education. That was not my point. There’s no need for you to twist my words just to sound clever. My point is that NCA is an institution where people from all over Pakistan come to get their degrees. That in itself says that your education is besides the point, Somebody earlier also commented that being bi-lingual is considered a quality, even in institutions abroad. But then you should make use of both languages and not look down on the poor kid from a rural area, as if he is an insignificant rat.
Coming back to the point at hand, the protest had no posititive outcome. It created more confusion, students wasted their time instead of working on their assignments/thesis. You should have let the faculty handle it. And yes you are being very dramatic and idealistic. You know very well you cannot bring about any change. Both sides are well connected and can get their way in the end. That’s how things work in our country.
If you are all about bringing about a revolution, it should be aimed at Zardari or at America. And I still like you and consider you one of my best friends.
And as far as credentials are concerned, Bashir Ahmad is the only person in NCA who has a Masters degree in Public Administration. He is also the first male principal in a long time. First came Salima, then came Sajida, then Naazish and then Fauzia. Was this just a mere coincidence? I think not. There’s no transparency here either. Why didn’t anybody protest?
The title given to this discussion is “What’s going on at NCA?” I might not have said much about the politics, but I did talk about the acacdemics. Things are going on at NCA that I would protest against. I don’t really give a f*** about who is principal, but I have a plea too. Call shit, shit! Do not mutilate the Arts.
Zainab I will have to disagree with you here. I think the students have a right to express their opinions and although a lot of this situation got messy it is just a start towards developing a proper student’s guild. One that we have been paying for in our fees for years. Once a proper platform is ready, all issues and progressive criticism will be routed through proper channels. That way only the student guild will be responsible for managing such affairs and the students who do not wish to get involved in politics (like yourself and many of my other good friends) do not have to. and everyone can return to what they love – making art, music, buildings, design. It is a bumpy road but it will lead to a hopefully more informed future for our students.
Also I think Awais might have misinterpreted your words, but this is a complaint I’ve heard one too many times in NCA. People who are well-versed in English are automatically thrown into a mould of ‘burger kids’ with no connection to the ‘poor kid’.
I know you have the best of intents and your opinions are just as valuable, but I hope you will try to understand that many students over the past many many years have been disturbed by the politics at NCA (myself included) and I hope these are addressed at some point. My khala, a fellow student of Bashir Shb and Arfan Ghani also mentioned politics back then when a real TITAN like Shakir Ali was thrown over by internal politics.
God Save NCA because I, along with a bazillion others, really owe a lot to that institute.
Zainab Chaudhry, it is unfortunate to see that you think that this protest achieved nothing, and that people are just being idealistic. Are you saying that the only revolution worth having is against Zardari and America? It is an entirely defeatist, not a realistic attitude to believe that change is impossible. And why should we let the faculty resolve the issue, when it became so obvious during the meeting that they were divided, and the politics within the faculty are detrimental to the running of the institute as well? Why shouldn’t the students have a say in the matter of their education? What solution do you propose? That we should just twiddle our thumbs, and wait for other people to do what is necessary? ThAT is how change will never happen. What the protest did achieve was an open and honest dialogue between the teachers and students, plus, the students now know that their voice has weight and that they need not fear standing up for themselves when something is unjust. It is unrealistic to expect dramatic changes to take place after just one meeting; change happens slowly and with consistency and effort. You don’t just clap your hands and get what you want. And the protest was not regarding only this situation, but a general situation that has evolved over time where people got what they wanted through corrupt means and nobody stood up to them out of fear.
ap jesay he logon na tu NCA ka bera gharak keya ha jo hum log bhugat rahay ahn tc tc tc bus sub ka pata ha humain khud 2 2 huftay teacher ni atay yahi waly tub time ni waste hota bus kr do
Faculty positions and admissions open at the School of Creative Arts, University of Lahore.
http://www.uol.edu.pk
oh wah! please allow me a minute or two of your time. saira you have provided a virtual platform, the advantages and disadvantages of which can be argued as exhaustively as the multitude of comments on this page. baharhaal, im not here to clarify rather just to voice. as one of the affectees of Irfan Ghanis outburst, i would like to say that these times are extremely trying, and possibly if i was in his place i might have done the same thing. i spoke extensively with a lot of the concerned faculty, including irfan saab, and some of the student body,yestewrday, and as far as the unfortunate (or maybe it wasnt because that really shook me up) incident is concerned lets just say that it was in the heat of the moment, and i respect my peers way too much to hold it against them when whats at stake is much bigger. and saira u r missing out man! its heartening to see how much goodwill and good intentions there are, especially amongst the students. there is hope for pakistan and for nca, if we have even a few people like that. the truth is that we have many, but very few who actually have the courage to take the lead. i hope the students pursue a students representative body, as well as the teachers for the teachers association with continuing zeal. that seems to be the only solution for the time being. politics aur yeh sab to chalta hai, everywhere, but checks and balances need to be instated, and sometimes they are initiated when the ugly head of anger, bursts, and there is always that element of chaos in it, which could have been much worse. i for one thought that the carnage was quite contained. ek aur baat. i want to thank my MA students, maria has been blogging, for standing up for me. will talk to u guys on friday.
Dear ‘Ms. Coordinator’, it really is very very heartening to see you here. I’m not sure what exact incident you are speaking of and why the students had to stand up for you, but from what I know about you its this: You have ALWAYS been supportive of the students and have taken a lot of heat and drama on our account. You have listened to our problems and you made sure they were forwarded to the right places, even if they were approved or not. You were aware of ALL the politics and lobbying, especially regarding the attacks aimed at the MA but you REALLY stood up for the department and its students despite all odds.
And it was because of you that I got to experience some of the best South Asian Seminar classes ever. I owe a lot of my MA experience to you and thank you for keeping the original spirit alive.
I will use this platform to let you know how much I respect you and appreciate your efforts.
I agree. The differences lie between the teachers about the mode of action but not at all about the action itself. I believe that the senior staff will put their differences aside and set an unprecedented example to mutually nurture the country’s state of arts. It not only exists on an academic level but also on a professional one. It is disheartening to see so many potential masters of the trade not going anywhere and stifling in the suffocating clutches of the distorted art/design/architecture market
@zainab: Masters in public administration??? are you serious?? i bet bashir never learnt anything in that degree, the public is on the loose, the classes are off, the teachers are unhappy, the lower staff are on the verge of a nervous breakdown because basheera cut their feeble pays in half, the fee structure is as lame as himself, students dont get to go anywhere, the quality of work goes down everyday, and during all this adminsitration of the public, basheera just simply sits in the office. never have i heard him speak publicly to address the students in the college about any matter that holds substance, or even outside (convocation??). no one is allowed to talk to the al frikkin mighty, and if a hearing is granted then it always ends with basheera cursing the f*** out of the addressee… great job i’d say.
Master in Public Administration…lol….tabhi to mai kahun ke os ne mujhay kue aia kaha ” mai jutti la kay teray mun te mar deyanga”…when i asked ke “sir plz hostel mai spray karwa dain”..lol…zainab chaudhary..you are funny i must say.
kamran aka kirla teray mun pay sab ka joota lagna chahiye aik baar. youre pathetic. bashir kay haath may itni jaan nahi kay woh tera mun seedha kar day, laikin jab sab jootiya paraingi toh sab set hojeyga. dontworry. keep your faith intact in shahrukh khan movies. youll make it big
hi saira
i just want to say that i had been in this college for past 10 year i think…and i loved it but when i joined the faculty as a TA….its a total Mess..Horrible place to be it…it have its own lobbies and everyone want to do the thing in their own way…anyways what happening from the past week is really something which i have never seen..i wasn’t their in the meeting but what i am hearing is really crazy…it like they all Vomited it out…the teacher the student everyone!…
i am at no ones side because i think every single person is there to save their own asses and not bothered about others..buss!! my stance on this is the it should have been done in more respectful way…one should definitely convey their message but NOT get on personal level…don’t like a our political talk shows that we see on TV…
one thing more which is my personal opinion is that the meeting should only be done by the faulty Students should had not be their…whatever teacher are like..there shoud be a respectable level between students and teachers..
But Sarah, therein lies the problem! Backdoors, closed meetings, lobbying, hidden personal agendas.We’ve had our (un?)fair share of all of them. It was about time we were taken into confidence because misinformation or the lack of any information at all was clearly not helping anyone. This meeting was not supposed to provide a boxing ring for two parties. Rather, it was supposed to address our rightly held concerns. I mean, personally, I would be very upset if I was pitting my support for an insincere cause only because I didn’t know any better.
Arguably, the meet became somewhat of a spectacle and at some moments the decorum was somewhat violated. But hey, that is only to be expected if the entire student body is allowed to be present. However, in the absence of student representatives we can not help this situation where each fends for his/her self. Here, I would like to stand for many students who did not fall prey to mob psychology and conducted themselves admirably throughout the meeting. Moreover, the administration that now complains of being ‘victimized’ demonstrated complete disregard for our concerns throughout this meeting. They lost their only chance at salvaging the situation when some refused to be present (whatever the reason may be) and others kept walking out on the proceedings despite pleas by the students that we were genuinely interested in hearing their side of the story. Power, unfortunately, has hormonal effects on the ego.
As far as respecting teachers is concerned, I completely agree with you. But I would like to remind you of the principle upon which the notion of such respect is based. We do not respect teachers by virtue of their position but because of the role they play in our instruction. If someone is insincere to that rule, it doesn’t make them my teacher despite being an employee of my college. I would respect them as much as I would respect any human being but they can not ask for the admiration that is particularly associated with a teacher.
what do you mean by calling the students faulty who stood for the their rights and the rights to know why is the college is such a mess?
There were few questions people had asked from me earlier but i didn’t answer as my questions were not really answered rather most of you guys tried to twist some facts and tried to ridicul me.
I do not hate anyone on personal basis. If you had read my first article you would have noticed it that i said i would vote for Maryam hussain’s return. I know two people from my department out of these four you guys protested for. And i did not vote for Leila Rehman as she who was supposed to be teaching at college as a contractual appointee was on leave for almost a year i suppose and still got her contract renewed as she seems to be having quite credentials i do not know……….
I did not leave 230 from audi rather 330 and that is when it seemed like the things had gotten to an end.
I never have said that i am not in for student’s cause. But i won’t buy this sudden change of protest for teachers to protest for students slogan. If you had started that either before this or after this. I would have been with you guys.
When students protested for hostel stuff last year i had allowed them to go when the administration had said that i should not allow them to go for that. Who do you think you guys are blaming?
And yes it is I who is right now typing my words.
And me being loud in the audi is not just but you guys trying to misbehave at the gate is really fine and pushing me in the auditorium while i was talking to a crowd gathered on all four sides of me was really right too !!!!
I still have my Panache, while you guys seem to have lost yours i suppose.
I had and have valid questions whether you try to hide from them or try to insult me or Atteqa or bring my son into it. Quite shameful games you guys play i would say.
Why the protest (protest for reinstatement of teachers) was changed dramatically into protest for students rights?
And a little bit of answer from my own side!
Because it seemed like these guys were doing too much of I I I I I, me, me, me, me. So they thought it would be a good idea to portray to the world that they are not really talking about themselves only. And they are the real well wishers of this institution.
And i was also thinking that these four people actually did not name the other three or four teachers whose contracts were not renewed by the same authorities, naming Mahnaz Malhi, MH Jafri, Sarwat Ali and probably Shirin Pasha. And two of them being HOD’s. Why????
The contractual appointments were made on favoritism (the ones i questioned in the audi) but that is another story that some do end up in favor of the students as some people have got brains while mostly are no good to the institution. I am not saying these words to make somebody happy but this is the truth i am sharing which i had shared earlier in my first post.
If students were really protesting for their rights then i would have been part of them.
In any case during this protest when i had talked to huzaifa and Ahmed i suppose i had said that doing a protest is their right.
Would you have any courage to give me a credit for that rather than blaming me because it seemed to you guys that i was targeting your favorite teachers on someone else’s dictations or i hated them. Sorry i don’t do that.
I only protested and said things because of the way things were handled and because i do care about this institution.
I am the the guy who in 1997 came to see this college from my home town in Jhelum and asked Salam Chaca whom i didn’t know at that time to enter and see it but he said to me that you can not enter the college as you are not a student but if you
[know somebody]
then i can let you go in to meet. I didn’t know anybody at that time and it seems like i do not know anybody still…….
And please check my credentials here.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hasnat_Mehmood
Thanks you guys for your real healthy talks and Hoorah for the beginning of a revolution…
Dear Hasnat as you mentioned above that NCA only recognized on international forum just becoz of fine arts department. i would like to inform you that you are not well aware about architecture department of NCA and great teachers.
two years ago the students of NCA architecture department went to INDIA to attend international seminar or meeting held by NASA.120 universities participated in that meeting from different parts of all over the world.
the Students of NCA architecture won 3 international AWARDS, RUBEINS award is one of them for the best university award amongst 120 universities, and NCA architecture students won that (REBUINS) award just becoz of 2nd and 3rd years studio works which were presented over there.
go to NCA archives and check. 🙂
@2nd year studio teacher = Aqeel KAzmi
@3rd year studio incharge = Arfan Ghani
@ hasnat plz now show me the example of fine arts department.
mr hasnat, i feel sorry that you just could not understand what we students want and where do you TEACHERS stand for us madam atiqqa is our teacher we have the right of asking questions asking for our right..why are you asking us question on the same time!!!!we are sick of our teachers politics seriously we need a break…why us what wrong did we ask why are you not addressing our problems instead of defending your self…i seriously feel like crying at the moment…….
Zainab Chaudhry i too consider you as one of my best friends. 🙂 And i wasnt twisting ur words but rather that bit about English was written in response to what sir Hasnat had written earlier:
‘@ (Arsalan) good writing skills won’t get you much here. Facts are quite darker than your enlightened report.’
And what you have said about using both languages and not making anyone feel like their educational background is not sufficient i totally agree with you! We are very proud of our diverse student body and everyone must be catered to, in terms of language and otherwise. otherwise the entire purpose of having that diversity is lost!
Coming to what the Coordinator said Ma’am (i am taking a guess here from what s.a said) you are right politics in any place can never be finished off suddenly but rather yes checks and balances are what is important. And i think you might be pleased to hear that the effort to form a student guild is well under way and from what was said at the meeting the teachers are making an effort for a staff association as well. The meeting might have meant a lot of anger and pinpointing by all sides yet if we can come out of these 3 days together, both students and faculty, and efforts such as these to form representative bodies continue then these days have been well worth it.
Sir Hasnat you asked “Why the protest (protest for reinstatement of teachers) was changed dramatically into protest for students rights?” well in actuality aren’t both the same thing? us demanding that our teachers not be discharged in the middle of the academic year is us fighting for our rights. there is no difference between the two. And as for the issues that were raised by the students in the audi they are all part and parcel of a system that allows corruption. And it is that system that we are fighting for. We wish only for a transparent system. And hopefully the student guild and a staff association on your part will allow us to achieve this transparency to some degree. But other actions must also be taken but that is in the hands of the decision making bodies who hopefully have heard our voice . And as you said Hoorah for the beginning of a revolution! let us hope that all our efforts of these past 3 days were not in vain and that we see some long term change emerge for the better. We hope that in the future all decisions will be based on what is better for the institution and those who wish to learn and teach here.
aw! thx s.a.
In honor of the freedom of expression that we boast and inspire to, i will post a comment on behalf of a friend who has been blocked from voicing herself on this forum. Ironic.
This does not in any way reflect my own opinion – i feel we need to respect and show tolerance for everyone’s beliefs even if they may oppose one’s own, for freedom does not mean expressing an accord. Freedom is the understanding that all beliefs are equally valid.
Zainab Chaudhry
You can choose to disagree with me but their hypocrisy should be exposed! You can say that since so many people had adressed me, I wanted to reply to them.
Saira whether you agree with me on the whole students protest or not, is your own affair. I will have to correct you at one point though. I wasn’t talking in clichés. I wasn’t talking about how students respond to the “poor kids” and I wasn’t saying the “burger kids” are bad.
I was telling you about my own experience, where teachers made that distinction. Since everyone seems to have missed my point, I will clear it out once again. I think it is unfair that certain teachers give the “poor kid” preferential treatment and certain teachers think that they are just idiots because they can’t articulate a sentence in English. I was speaking against both the orientalist and the colonial way of looking at this.
M. I will not respond to what you have said. An angry mob has no name; you can therefore remain comfortably anonymous. If it takes courage to protest, then I hope that by the time you graduate, you will have acquired some.
The problems that everyone seems to be having is with the “system”. And that is people and their colonial attitude. Protest if you must. But then aim your guns in the right direction too. Target all the culprits instead of just some of them. This country was made and is run by bounty hunters. There, I said it! I think it’s even more defeatist to think that if you protested against Zardari (which makes more sense) you would achieve nothing. I was being more Robespierre about the whole thing, if anything.
Xenab,
Zainab Chaudhhry was NOT blocked and I have cleared it out with her. Due to the excess of comments (more than 80 in 2 days) the spam check is loading most of the comments into the pending box and only lets a few through. I have to log in every day and clear them through. I have already told her this and that I value her feedback. Even if it might negate mine. She has maintained absolute decorum throughout and i appreciate it completely. We both engaged in a very mature dialogue actually. Regarding the comments: Zainab, maintaining that decorum, emailed me first questioning why her comments were not being posted. I would appreciate that you not judge me as being hypocritical next time since I have shown support to both voices on this debate.
I do not ‘boast’ of freedom of speech. I respect and follow it.
Xaneb,
Thank you for your support. I was getting frustrated because I could not respond to all the people who were addressing me but I have cleared it out with Saira now.
kaun kistnay pani man ha ya tu apko pata chal he geya ho ga aur meray bewi buchon ko ni laow beach man huzaifa tu kisi ka bucha ni ha hena? meray pass photo ha huzaifa ka ap k dil man us wakt b chor tha k man is ki pic la lon aur jafri pasha zaffar aur basher sahb sa shabash la lon kyun k huzaifa kisi ka bucha ni ha hena us ka future 2 mint man tabah kr don apnay buchon pa tu ap ko foran tars a gey hena?
ata ha nature ha insan ki aur ap jo buchon k sculpter chura k la jatay ho wo?
ap kitnay loyal han institute k sath sub ko pata ha jo teacher kisi student ko ya keh k bheaj da oye man tumara teacher hon ?
ni tu jao apnay teacher sa pocho
then i salute to the teachers jo canteen man beth k b paratay han wo bucha FA ka ho ya kisi b dept ka un k leay student he ha so i yhink samaj a ge ho gi k kis sculpter aur kis student k bat ho ri ha agr ni i btana man evidence b da don ga……………….thnx
Hasnat… i wont call you sir or even Mr because you don’t deserveto be given that much importance and respect after i saw you shouting in the audi on the first years as if they are your slaves…let me tell you…they aren’t…they are your students..if u want respect..u have to give them respect too…its a two way traffic so….anyways in the start of the first meeting which was only for the student body of nca…the so called hasanat came to the audi and started shouting on the mic that 1st years, come to the drawing class imedeiately…than he asked us who is the leader..we said everyone one of us is the leader…than he said i have huzaifa’s picture taken at the gate stopping students from coming inside and strict action will be taken against him…after that the students came to argue in a polite manner and but he didn’t listen and kept on shouting,,,in the meanwhile someone asked the 1st years that do you want to go wid him…evry 1st years no matter how many they were shouted a big “NO”…..hasnat if u had some self respect you wud have left the audi the same moment but you didnt…..than i myself had to switch off the mic…the students informed him that it is a student body meeting,,,and we will definetly listen to you once the student faculty meeting starts at 1 pm…but to no use……. i personally pledged that plz sir ap is kollege ke student reh chukay hain…plzzz ager koi is kollege ki bhalai keliye kch ker raha hai to osay kernay de ….he kept on arguing and shouting,,,,and than we all decided that if he is not listening to any of our requests, than we are not talking to him…..during this whole time seriously when i looked at you….i saw a MAO kollege ka ghunda….jisko ye lagta hai ke ager mai cheekhunga cheelaunga ya action lenay ki dhamki dunga to students chup hojayengay or dar ke maray classes mai chalay jayengay….khush fehmi hai aapki…write watever you wana write in ur defence….the students know your reality now…i call you a bias and indecent person who has no respect for his students or other students of the college…than you mentioned the event of the next meeting….and you said the students were like we are sorry for we did…and u called it a crime…let me correct you….when you said closing the gates was an illegal action…the students said yes we know that wat we did was illegal but we learned from our teacher who do countless illegal things….you asked “are you talking about those four teacher whos contract are not renewed? ( dont you have any respect for those senior teachers sitting in front of you? ) the students replied no we are talking about you while pointing fingers at you…why coz we stand in the long lines under the burning sun in the bank to submit our fees while the kollege peons submit your utility bills…those peons raise your son while they should be at our service…. aren’t we your children…dont u wana raise us too…??? if i had a mirror i would have shown you your face…it was worth looking at….! enough for the meeting….Do you remember once you asked a student of sculpture if he want to sell his sculpture…he said no i dont wana sell it….you said ok….when the student came back after the summer vacation….his sculpture was stolen…do you have any idea who stole it?? i m sure you have…moving forward….one of my class mate came to you to get help in his caligraphy minor assignment coz he thought you can help him….he was shocked to hear you saying…tm kiss class mai ho…he said sir 3rd year…you said “i m not your teacher and go ask your own teacher”….what a shame full reply by a teacher…you call yourself a teacher….let me tell your are not even an inch near to the status of a teacher…..such a hypocrite you are….telling the first year students in your clas that you guys shoud not have been a part of this protest coz ur seniors are using you…bhai jaan konsay dunya mai rehtay ho….the nca student body is back into business kicking asses of the corrupt, the one who are lobbying on every channel possible and the politicians in nca….so i advise you to watch yours 🙂 one thing more…if you think you can scare us by saying action will be taken…challenge me and i will tell you my name…but once you have challenged me..either you will have to kick me out of the kollege or else you will resign from you weathy post…!
Mr. Hasnat, first of all let me say that regardless of what others might say to you, I have a lot of respect for you because regardless of all the accusations that are being made against you here, at least you’re still replying on this forum. I’m in fourth year architecture, and you have never taught me, so i really have no right to say whether you’re a good teacher or not. However, there are a few things that I would like to clarify. Being one of the students who had a role in the strike, I firstly want to assure you that this protest was NOT organized by ANY teacher. I know that people did get this impression. But right from the very start, this was something that even I was fighting against, and to make sure that it remains a student protest. The teachers protested, but their protest had nothing to do with ours, which was why they did not join us outside the College.
At the end of the first day of the protest, we announced that unless our demand of ‘reinstating the teachers’ was met, we would boycott the classes. We did NOT call them on the second day. Those who did come, came of their own accord. And even on the first day, yes, the students were stopped from entering the college, but NO ONE was forced to be a part of the strike.
On the second day, Mr. Mohsin Iqbal started playing his tactics by planning a trip to Naran with the first years. That same day, some thesis students from the design department argued with us that they be allowed to attend their classes. That evening, we had a meeting, which those design students attended as well. Mr. Arfan Ghani explained to those students what was actually going on in college, and urged them to stand against it. However, I plainly told Sir Arfan that regardless of everything, the students should have the right to choose for themselves, and we should respect them for their opinions. These were the so-called tactics that the students played. We requested Mr. Arfan to explain his side to the whole student body, so that they should know what they’re fighting for, and that they should choose for themselves as to whether they wanted to be a part of it or not.
Later on, we ourselves decided that we would call ALL the the faculty, without even consulting Sir Arfan or anyone, so that this supposed other side would get the chance to explain themselves. The reason that other student issues were brought up was that the night before the auditorium meeting, there was a students’ meeting in which many students raised other questions, particularly the first and second years. True, they might not have had much to do with these four teachers, but THEY wanted answers to the problems that they were facing. And Sir, we did not PLAN on how to advance the meeting. The only thing we had decided was that ALL students be given the chance to voice their concerns, whatever those concerns might be. Like I said, I do not know you personally, but I feel that what you did in the auditorium at the first meeting was wrong. In a earlier post, you criticized a student on being anonymous, and not revealing his name. How do you expect someone to do that when everyone saw you targeting Huzaifa.
As for the question of firing those four teachers, the reasons WE the seniors protested against it is that it was illegal, based on personal politics, and not because of who those people were. Any such decision is made by the Executive Committee. In this case, however, they were not even consulted. I do not personally know Maryam Hussain or Laila Rehman, so I cannot say if they are good teachers or not. But I can say that the process by which they were fired was wrong. That was what we were fighting against, and that is what we told the rest of the student body. As for Ma’am Malhi, or Sir Sarwat Ali, or Shireen pasha, or Sarosh Arfani, or M.H. Jaffri, their contracts have expired and cannot be renewed because they are now above 60. The RULE is that they can only continue as visiting faculty is they want to.
Sir, the whole point of the meeting was that everything be laid out in front of the students, and they should decide for themselves. I must point out that teachers from both sides got personal, which we were all against. But the students, to quite an extent, refrained from that. The point was to make the teachers realize that they are all there for the students, not for their own lousy politics, and to expose anyone who thought otherwise. And that I think we did. As for the principal issue, it was made clear that it was the teachers who were fighting for that, they might continue to do so. But since the teachers themselves were reinstated, therefore the students would resume classes. As for the rest of the issues of the students, the Students Guild would immediately be formed to address them.
Sir, I understand that there is lobbying in this College, but what I’m trying to emphasize here is that we students are not and do not want to be a part of it. So please do not think otherwise.
i know kitna role ha strike man chaplose insan tum khud idr ki batie udr krtay thay bohat he sherm ki bat ha tuman pata ni shiad k humain sub pata ha mr tum ak sal sa ro rahay ho teri koi ni sunta becoz u r corrupt person
teri class teray baray man kya kehti ha zara pochien ja k
Please control your comments or I will have to delete them. This is a forum for reasonable debate. Not namecalling and misbehaving. This behaviour sets a bad impression on all the students who are trying to do something good. We are educated young people who want NCA to become better – but through proper channels, not misbehaving. I have no problem if you write all your concerns more rationally. I won’t object even if they are completely against my opinion or someone else’s.
I request you to please respect my space as a forum for dialogue.
I know very well what my class thinks about me. If I had anything to hide, I wouldn’t be using my name here. So I really don’t need to give a crap about someone who can make accusations but is afraid of revealing his name.
Saira whether you agree with me on the whole students protest or not, is your own affair. I will have to correct you at one point though. I wasn’t talking in clichés. I wasn’t talking about how students respond to the “poor kids” and I wasn’t saying the “burger kids” are bad.
I was telling you about my own experience, where teachers made that distinction. Since everyone seems to have missed my point, I will clear it out once again. I think it is unfair that certain teachers give the “poor kid” preferential treatment and certain teachers think that they are just idiots because they can’t articulate a sentence in English. I was speaking against both the orientalist and the colonial way of looking at this.
M. I will not respond to what you have said. An angry mob has no name; you can therefore remain comfortably anonymous. If it takes courage to protest, then I hope that by the time you graduate, you will have acquired some.
The problems that everyone seems to be having is with the “system”. And that is people and their colonial attitude. Protest if you must. But then aim your guns in the right direction too. Target all the culprits instead of just some of them. This country was made and is run by bounty hunters. There, I said it! I think it’s even more defeatist to think that if you protested against Zardari (which makes more sense) you would achieve nothing. I was being more Robespierre about the whole thing, if anything.
I’m not sure if I should write anything in this forum because it seems that words get misconstrued. Looking over these posts that I only saw yesterday, I see some very angry comments, plain threats, and false accusations. I am not going to address these because they are not worth the time. But I do see some serious comments from students I presume. I know Awais and perhaps some of the others–sorry I teach 450 of you so it’s hard for me to know names. I want you guys to think about what you want and what Hasnat wants–I think there are parallels, but perhaps the way to achieve it is not the same. It seems to me that the serious protestors want to end corruption. I’m going to speak for Hasnat and defend him, not just because he is my husband but also because I think he has a valid point but he might not be saying it in a clear way. Hasnat wants to end corruption too, but he sees the system as corrupt. I feel the same way–it is not just an individual or a few individuals who, once weeded out, will clear the way for an open, honest system. I think it is much more complicated than that—and considering the actions of some people in the last few days, it seems like anyone can do corrupt things. A transparent system will take time and will require the students to take it to the top and question how people are both hired and fired–why should it be up to the PM to ultimately decide who is the principal of NCA. I think it is up to you guys to rise up above simply complaining about individuals and try to implement change–and change does not mean replacing one corrupt person for a different corrupt person. Instead it means changing business as usual so that people are not hired and fired according to the whims of the one in power. It means making changes in policy and the processes that the institution adopts.
Thank you so much for venturing into these grounds Dr. Atteqa. I agree with your points completely.
And I do understand that many of the opinions on both sides have been lost to emotions. While I may support the general and genuine appeal to change things in the system, I feel that few individuals have crossed the line by attacking Hasnat’s family and I did appeal to them in a comment before to not indulge in such commentary.
But I also do know that there are many well-meaning students involved in this who want a genuinely good change for NCA. And those who aren’t namecalling and attacking any individuals. They just want to see the ills addressed. Unfortunately it took this one event of the 4 teachers to trigger it off. But why not? The cauldron had been bubbling for too long and something was going to set it off. Even if it was something like this which was very individual-specific.
The one thing to appreciate is that (even though things did get dirty) it is still a far cry from what students all over the country do – physically attacking the other sides, taking up arms, destroying public property, and creating chaos that ends any coherent dialogue. I think I would still appreciate the fact that this does not happen in our students.
Totally agreed.it was a good example for others. A silent protest, not a single property of the college was destroyed. I just want to emphasize on the fact that we are the young generation and if we don’t stand up for our rights and the ills of the society than sooner or later we will be a spiritually dead nation. And for those who thinks that our whole system including the rulers is corrupt than let me tell you that we can start from our streets, our institutions and our work areas the fight to curb politics, favourism and badmashi. 🙂
I completely agree with Atteqa Ali.
Zainab Chaudhry you didnt replied on the comment on Sir Bashir having a Masters in Public Administration? if he had any knowledge of public administration than i dont think so the college will be in such a mess today.
liberal,
Bashir Ahmed actually has a Masters degree in Public Administration. I was stating a fact. The college was thrown into a mess when certain people’s power ( and by that I don’t mean Bashir) was challenged. There were some other deserving individuals who were also sacked, but they did not react. An angry mob cannot be controlled. The real culprits are not the ones who could not control it, but the ones who instigated it, my point was that even if someone was sacked unfairly, they should not have been so selfish as to involve the students in their squabbles. And if they cared about the students so much, they could have given students some time whether or not they were still at an important post in college.
We all know the importance of time for thesis students and already so much of it was wasted over dengue fever. This new stunt just wasted their time a little more. I said in an earlier post that both sides were well connected and would get what they wanted eventually. And that’s exactly what has happened. Although the whole students guild thing is a very legitimate point, why is it that nobody thought of it before? This was also a suggestion thrown in by the instigators to cover up their folly and selfishness.
Saira for a minute there I did misjudge you, and I apologize. I like your blog.
Well i dont know how many times sarah and hasanat should be told that not a single teacher involved us or motivated us to do this protest. It was we the student body who did what we thought was write to save our sinking institution.If we pay our fees than it is our responsibility to question the administration why are we not been given due attention, why our teachers are sacked in the middle of the year right before the thesis. If they had resolved all the issue than i dont think so that our precious time which you mentioned in your post would have been wasted. And about the other faculty members who were not reinstated. well we have a reason not to protest becoz they were 60 or above 60 and you have to retire after you are 60 years of age. And the four teachers who were recently not reinstated were below 60 so we had a ligimate point to defend and question their earlier dismisal. Why dont you understand that everyone of us are aware of wats going on in the colllege.we are not kids just like hasnat mentioned that most of the students didnt even know who the four teachers were. yes most of them didnt .but later on they did know after the students meetings including the last student body meeting in which hasanat came and tried to scare us by saying i have huzaifa’s picture and i will take strong action. I just want to say that you are the teacher of foundation course so please do your job which is teaching and not influeincing or scaring your students.Stop lobying, just teach.We know wat we are doing, We are alive and not dead.We know what is right and what is wrong. And for those who say why didnt you guys protested earlier, well i have seen a protest every year during my stay in college but unfortunately know one listen to us so you have to shake them to wake up.
I just wanted to mention, that the student’s guild had been proposed many times before as well by many different batches and several (Much) Smaller scale protests were also done in the main court yard during 2006 & 07 (which i have witnessed). But with time and also because the administration purposely delays it and due to (work load, thesis & fears of being picked on) the whole agenda just fizzles away.
If the students want the guild made, they really need to stick in there and push for it, with all they have and get Guild recognized as soon as possible (with in days) Otherwise if prolonged the objective will slowly fade.
there will be no Guild just like before. The student’s Guild is a must now, specially if we are speaking about accountability.
The guild is the need of the hour not just because we are having serious administrative accountability problems but also for helping with other social reforms.
You just need to focus and stay on track.
Peace.
p.s.
I am proud of you guys for making this effort 🙂
Thank you so much for the apreciation Khanistan 🙂
What I cannot really understand is even if there is a student’s guild, how can one person be chosen to represent all the students? The students (much like the faculty) are also divided. I certainly could not and would not let any one else speak for me, unless it’s me.
Do the students view Bashir Ahmed as a weak link? I think they have been trained to despite their claims that they weren’t asked to do this. There’s other ways of asking something also, you sometimes don’t need a direct command. [Mark Antony for instance roused the Romans against Caesar’s assassins without saying a single word against them]. If somebody is not in the studio, I don’t see how it is Bashir’s problem. I gave my thesis too and I honestly didn’t care who was saying what about my work, I didn’t even care who was principal, because these things had no influence on my work. I didn’t even want to talk to any one of the teachers; I thought that the moment to be spoon fed had expired. If anything it taught me self-reliance and at least I can say that I am an individual and I cannot be seen as part of the whole.
One more thing as far as the students’ guild is concerned, as Attiqa Ali said, first you need to root out all the corruption before you can have anything that is fair. Otherwise the appointemnt for the person who will represent the students is also going to be based on favoritism.
Another thing that I’ve been wanting to say is that it is a very Pakistani mentality to like the underdog. As much as I regret what happened and as horrible as it was, but as soon as Benazir was assassinated she became this exalted being. Everyone forgot about what a corrupt person she was, everyone forgot her crimes against humanity.
Even within our college this mentality prevails.Bashir Ahmad has been unfairly marginalized and his contributions to the modern miniature have always gone un-noticed. The credit has always gone to Zahoor ul Ikhlaq (who I have nothing against). I’m just saying that Basir has done more, If a maniac murders someone it cannot have any influence on his Art. When Sharon Tate was murdered, Hollywood did not proclaim her the best actress that ever happened to the film industry. just saying. There are four underdogs in NCA and everyone is on their side too.
:O 😛
yaar freedom of expression hona chaheye…..mere commment agr thoray hatt k hotay hain tu delete tu na kiya karo….baby ye free zone hai…..
Free zone hai and that has already been proven. But I cannot allow you to use such filthy language on this blog. I’m sorry but aur bhi tareekay hain free baat kernay kay.
@ Hamza Shakoor. Suna hai apka Mohsin Iqbal se mil jana or 4rth year archi ke trip ki tayari kerna. apka intehai L hona.
hamza ka L hona aur chay b…..mf
yaar kya level hai iss banday ka…hazar bandun ko L kara k ye apna faida soch raha hai aur hamare bech reh k dusman ka kaam karta hai…asal yahudi nikla…hypocrite….aur hum dartay tumare baap se b nai…..dartay tu tum ho jo chup chup k links rakhtay ho k agr hawa ka rukh badal jae tu tum be rukh mor lo…..
koi n nation tab tak nai bikharti jab tak oske aNDAR apnay he banday ghaddari nai kartay…..hamare bech ka ghaddar be pehchana gya jo student guild k president k khawab itni duur le gaya k hum sab ko bechnay ka soch lia….LLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL
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